[Congratulations! Keio Senior High School Baseball Team Koshien Victory] [Commemorative Victory Dialogue] Until "Enjoy Baseball" Seized the Crown: Makoto Ueda / Takahiko Moribayashi

Congratulations on becoming number one in Japan. How does it feel to have won the championship?

Thank you very much. Immediately after the victory, it felt strange, almost surreal, but with every ceremony, reporting session, and interview opportunity, the reality is gradually sinking in. I also feel every day how many people truly supported us and are happy for us.

First, I'd like to ask about the journey to the Koshien victory. Last year, you lost to Tokai University Sagami in the quarterfinals of the summer prefectural tournament. When you formed the new team after that, did you think it was a team with the potential to become number one in Japan?

I didn't feel that way at all. Among this year's members, the only one who played as a regular on last summer's team was the shortstop, Hinata Yagi. The others couldn't break in, and Sora Omura wasn't even on the bench.

I didn't feel like the position players could hit that well, and I wondered who should pitch. I knew Kiichi Matsui couldn't do it alone, and I was full of anxiety at the start, hoping someone would step up.

You lost 6-3 to Yokohama High School in the final of the autumn prefectural tournament, but you made the top four in the Kanto tournament. I felt the team grew stronger with every game from around that time.

For this year's team, the presence of the captain, Omura, was huge. He spoke of being "number one in Japan" at every opportunity, and everyone would chant "number one in Japan" together before practice. Setting such a high goal was one key factor; it might seem simple, but it's important.

Under that captain, the players rallied together with a strong awareness that we had to unite. As we won our way through the autumn tournament, I think their ability and confidence grew bit by bit.

Also, it was significant that the pitcher Masaki Oyake was finally able to pitch by the autumn tournament. Until around the summer a year ago, he couldn't pitch at all due to lower back pain. Just as the new team started moving, he began pitching little by little, and it was immediately clear he was our best pitcher. From there, we moved through the prefectural and Kanto tournaments by combining him effectively with the experienced Matsui.

So you gradually became stronger and secured a spot in the Senbatsu (Spring Koshien). What did you focus on during your winter training?

Mainly the physical aspect, centered on weight training. For the past year or two, Professor Takayuki Inami from the university's Institute of Physical Education has guided us on how to do weight training and how to create weight menus based on player types. Previously, the team had a uniform menu, but we revised it and made it a major point to strengthen the body while paying attention to the fine details.

In the autumn, we still lacked power in our swings and felt we couldn't hit fast pitchers, but through physical strengthening over the winter, each individual has gained considerable power.

In the Senbatsu, your first opponent was last summer's champion, Sendai Ikuei. They had a wonderful pitching staff, but Oyake pitched well, and it became a great game decided by a single run (a 1-2 loss in an extra-inning tiebreak). How did that loss affect the team? I feel like that loss somehow led to the summer national championship.

In the final of the spring prefectural tournament, your hitting power grew tremendously in that short interval (an 11-0 victory against Soyo High School). What kind of practice did you do for that?

We strengthened our bodies over the winter, our swings got stronger, and we reached a level where we could compete to some extent in the Senbatsu. However, facing Sendai Ikuei's wonderful pitching staff and being unable to hit much, I think it was important to experience firsthand that this is what a top-level national pitching staff is like.

Subsequent practice was based on the speed and the break of the breaking balls of Sendai Ikuei's pitchers. After all, facing top-level pitchers is the best way to establish a standard. We set our theme for the summer as how to hit Sendai Ikuei's pitchers and how to score runs.

Specifically, we focused on how to not miss and how to drive the few "sweet" pitches that a pitcher might throw—maybe only one per at-bat—and aimed to catch them on the first pitch during practice. I think that was a major factor in improving our hitting and scoring ability toward the summer.

I often watched the summer Kanagawa prefectural tournament with the university's manager, Tetsuya Horii, and it was almost as if the high school players hit better than the university players (laughs). That's how strong they were against fastballs and how they didn't crumble against breaking balls. They would hang in there after two strikes, try safety bunts, and do anything to break down the opposing pitcher. They had speed too; wasn't it offensive power at the highest level? It was truly fun baseball to watch.

I think the one who showed remarkable growth since spring was the left-hander, Kamon Suzuki. How did you think about utilizing Suzuki?

From the time he entered as a freshman, there was no doubt he was a great talent, and I wondered how to develop him. To win through the summer in Kanagawa, Oyake and Matsui alone wouldn't be enough. Another pitcher who could start was essential. We had no choice but to count on Suzuki. How to make him a full-fledged player was a major theme for the team. For the summer prefectural tournament, I wanted to go with Oyake and Suzuki as a "double ace" system, with Matsui supporting from behind.

Actually, Suzuki wasn't doing very well before the summer prefectural tournament. Even during the tournament, in the quarterfinal against Yokohama Sogakkan, he came in as a reliever and gave up consecutive bases-loaded walks, and there was a game where we barely survived by bringing Oyake back in.

However, the day after that quarterfinal, he spoke with the mental coach, Shinji Yoshioka, and it seems something cleared in his mind. After that, through the semifinals (against Tokai University Sagami) and the final (against Yokohama), his physical and mental condition went on an upward trend toward Koshien, so I felt I could let him pitch in key moments at Koshien.

He achieved the growth we expected toward the summer. I think this truly supported the team's breakthrough.

Another player who surprised me by the summer was Yagi. In the spring, he was hitting in the lower part of the lineup. Also, in his first and second years, I didn't think his defense was that great. However, he grew rapidly by this summer.

He also had many periods where he was injured or not in perfect physical condition. Even last autumn, he dislocated his shoulder before the Kanto tournament. In the Senbatsu, he was in the lower lineup and was eventually replaced by a pinch hitter. So I think he had a strong feeling that he couldn't go on like this.

I have a sense that in the end, he developed himself and exploded. Toward the summer, he increased his power and stability in both offense and defense, and as the number two hitter and in his shortstop defense, he played really well. There were many games that couldn't be discussed without him.

He really did a great job and shone in both offense and defense.

How was it after the game against Yokohama High School in the prefectural final? There were some controversial calls as well.

I have no intention of commenting on the calls, but the players accepted the situation immediately and responded quickly to what they should do next.

In the final attack in the 9th inning, with no outs and runners on 1st and 2nd, Yagi, the number two hitter, bunted properly. Then it was the 3rd and 4th hitters. I thought if we couldn't catch up and tie it here, it couldn't be helped. Then, they delivered with results. I think the fact that they could fight from start to finish without their hearts wavering or getting depressed is one of the strengths of this team.

If the strength of last year's team was about 100, I think this team was about 85. However, I think we were able to maintain mental stability and physical conditioning to bring out 100% of that 85.

In high school baseball, even if a team has 100 strength, there are almost no teams that can bring out 100. For this team, even though they didn't have such extraordinary power, I think it was good that almost everyone could demonstrate that power evenly during the games.

With stability in both the mental and physical aspects, I think they were able to remain unfazed even on the stage of the final with a Koshien berth on the line.

It was magnificent.

Before Sennosuke Watanabe's come-from-behind three-run home run, he hung in there with fouls and took close pitches. He had been attacked with changeups the whole time, but he adjusted during the game, and I think it finally bore fruit in that at-bat.

Did you say anything to him before he entered the batter's box?

No, not particularly (laughs).

I was surprised that he stood in the batter's box with a fearless smile. Normally, if you enter that at-bat trailing by two runs, you'd have an expression like you have to do something about it. But Sennosuke-kun smiled and was extremely relaxed; it seemed he was just thinking about taking a full swing with his own swing.

So you brilliantly won and went to Koshien, and you told the media from the start that you came to take the national title.

That's right. For this team, Omura had been saying "number one in Japan" all along, and it was a major keyword for everyone to unite, so we reconfirmed that together. I felt bad always making Captain Omura say it, so I decided to say it too (laughs).

But if you ask whether my confidence in being number one increased after winning the prefectural tournament, honestly, I didn't know. We had never advanced far at Koshien before. However, Koshien teams generally split into those satisfied just to be there and those who think they must win there, so I used that phrasing to show that we weren't just satisfied to be there, we came here to win.

At Koshien, what was the most difficult battle or the hardest part leading up to the final?

The first game against Hokuriku High School was on the 6th day. The waiting time was a bit long. We just repeated practice in the heat, and our game wouldn't come around. The time to think about unnecessary things kept increasing, and the week leading up to the first game was mentally tough.

As for the Hokuriku game itself, they hit from the first inning beyond my expectations, so I felt we entered the game very smoothly.

Was the Koryo game the toughest one?

Yes, indeed. Even looking back now, I think Koryo was strong, so I'm glad we won.

If we played 10 times, I think we'd only win 2 or 3 times, so I think this was thanks to the tiebreak. It's extremely difficult to score runs from Koryo's pitcher Takao-kun, who improved as the game went on, starting with no runners, so I was thinking of holding them to a tie until the 9th and somehow scoring in the extra-inning tiebreak. Anyway, I thought it was okay to be tied as long as we weren't overtaken.

As expected, they caught up in the bottom of the 7th, but we stopped them at a tie. It was truly a series of pinches every time, and the pitching staff and defense did well to hold them to 3 runs through the 9th. Also at the end, Matsui, who had been beaten by Sendai Ikuei in the Senbatsu, faced them at the end of the tiebreak and held on.

That pitching was good.

As a result, winning such a difficult game becomes the best experience. It was really tough while we were doing it, but looking back, that game became the one that gave us momentum and confidence toward the championship.

The opponent was the veteran Manager Nakai of Koshien regular Koryo, but watching it, I felt that we were the ones who played the game at our own pace. I had a feeling that Koryo was very conscious of Keio.

I suppose Koryo had a stronger awareness that they had to win. Their expressions were stiff.

I think we were more about enjoying it, or rather, feeling joy in the moment of being able to play a game against Koryo in such a setting. As a result, we were able to put out a better performance. In terms of raw material and strength, I think they were slightly superior, but I think we were able to bring out our power well.

In the quarterfinal (against Okinawa Shogaku), you went down by 2 runs early and experienced various games; I feel you grew stronger through that. You've become quite tough.

While playing the game, a kind of groundless confidence that we might win in the end or that we wouldn't lose might have spread through the team. We gave up 2 runs early against Okinawa Shogaku, but it was such a magnificent home run that it couldn't be helped.

Conversely, Kamon Suzuki held them down except for the home run, so that was within expectations. Originally, I didn't think we could hit Okinawa Shogaku's Higashionna-kun that much in the first half, and I thought there would be a chance in the second half when fatigue set in. I talked about that during the cooling time, but the players really worked hard.

In the 6th inning, Higashionna-kun's balls suddenly started to float, and it was brilliant how you broke him down all at once.

You also won the semifinal against Tsuchiura Nichidai, and finally, it's the final. What did you say to the players before the final?

I told them the night before that it was the best scenario. Having felt the frustration of losing to Sendai Ikuei in the spring, both schools have advanced to the final at Koshien. And we are aiming for our first championship in 107 years, while they are aiming for their second consecutive title.

It's a scenario that couldn't be better. For us, it's the best chance to repay the opponent we lost to, and whether we win or lose, tomorrow is the last day anyway, so let's play baseball to our heart's content.

What was the scene of the final like? Entering the field before the game. I think that must be unique. Only two teams left in the whole country. How did you feel about that atmosphere?

At that time, I was happy. It's a world I've always watched on TV, so I was truly happy that we were standing in that place. But, of course, there's the special feeling of the final, yet I also had mixed feelings, like wishing it wouldn't end today but continue.

Was the starting pitcher as you expected?

Yuda-kun was as I imagined. I thought they would save Takahashi-kun for later and come with the energetic Yuda-kun.

What kind of instructions did you give the players regarding strategy?

Regarding Yuda, the strategy was to hit the sliders he throws to get a count. His fastballs are quick and difficult to finish off.

Also, when we analyzed him, we found that half of his fastballs are actually balls. The sliders he throws for strikes come from a high release point, and since those are balls you guys can hit, we went in with the plan to go after those first.

Minato Maruta also swung and missed at a slider on the first pitch. But I think by swinging and missed at that one, he was able to time the next one. Anyway, I told them to make sure they hit the sliders.

You had third-year students and college coaches who took meticulous data starting from the Kanagawa Prefectural qualifiers. How was the data on Sendai Ikuei in actual practice?

In the last few years, we've entered an era where videos of almost all past games are available. In the case of Sendai Ikuei, we had footage from over a dozen games starting from last year's Koshien. The third-year staff and college coaches focused specifically on Sendai Ikuei and watched them in advance, so those behind-the-scenes efforts were extremely helpful.

We were able to tell the players with evidence that half of Yuda's fastballs are balls, and the college coaches this year were particularly excellent at coming up with a story that we could hit this guy while comparing our hitting power with the opponent's pitching power.

Of course, I convey it to the players after coordinating with the coaches, but it was data analysis that really made me want to say, "That's exactly right."

The coaches who looked at the batters were also truly wonderful. They would say things like, "This batter isn't in good form and absolutely cannot hit an inside fastball."

Oyake was attacking the inside as if it were easy, wasn't he?

That's right. There was a rationale, and we had a pitcher who could throw there and a catcher who could give those signs, so the victory was a result of all those factors coming together.

If you were to name just one key point of the final game, what do you think was the best thing?

The lead-off home run was great, of course, but it was the fact that we were able to get one more run in the first inning. If it had ended with just the one run from the home run, the damage wouldn't have been that great. By making it two runs, we ourselves felt a sense of certainty, like, "Oh, we got two runs off Yuda, we can do this."

Two runs in the first inning. And we also got a run in the second, so being able to take runs from Yuda early on gave us a sense of accomplishment and courage.

And then you scored a large number of runs in the fifth. Also, in the second half, you were aggressive even in defense. I thought it was brilliant that there wasn't a feeling of just trying to play it safe to get outs.

And so, you won the championship, but what were your thoughts at that moment?

Catching that fly ball to left field and everyone gathering together really looked like it was in slow motion, and it didn't feel very real. It was like I couldn't quite believe that this was actually our championship. Even though we had been seeking it for so long, when we actually became number one in Japan, I felt like I didn't know if it was reality or not.

I was also cheering in the Alps stands, and the Keio cheering section was in the left stands, and maybe even over to the right side. It was shocking, but when Maruta hit the home run, I wondered how many Keio people were there, and everyone all the way behind the backstop stood up. The stands were shaking. What kind of encouragement did that cheering provide?

I was truly happy. At Koshien, the benches face upward, so the cheering from both sides enters your eyes equally. You can see 360 degrees, and I thought, "Wow, there are people cheering for us not just in the Alps, but even in places like this."

Also, because of the effect of the silver roof, the way it resonates is completely different. It's a cliché expression, but it was truly the best support; it gives you courage, brings out your ability plus something extra, and it's a strange feeling where even painful things just fly away. I think we were granted a power that transcends reality.

Even those who aren't graduates of the high school cheer with all their might. It's the greatness of Keio University alumni, or rather, they cheer for us with the feeling that "we are comrades." That makes me very happy.

That's right. Even though there shouldn't be any female graduates (OGs) from the high school, a great number of women were also crying loudly. Being able to give back to those people in this way was the greatest joy of all, and it's truly thanks to everyone. They cheered for us as if it were their own matter, and it was the best support.

You often play games against Manager Kosuge of Tsuchiura Nichidai, whom you faced in the semifinals, and they were also a team that let their hair grow. In this tournament, quite a few teams were allowing freedom with their hair. Since we've always allowed freedom, weren't you interviewed about hair as well?

Yes. Inwardly, I was thinking, "Is this still a topic even in the Reiwa era?" but I think each school should just do what they want based on their own convictions. We don't necessarily think everyone should grow their hair out; we just say it's fine for each person to decide.

However, I did mention that I think the kind of "thought-stopping" where people assume high school baseball means buzz cuts isn't very good.

In the past, when we were lined up at the opening ceremony, just when I thought we were going to be shown, the camera would suddenly jump away. Everyone was taking off their hats, so they couldn't show such silky hair. It was like, "It's because it's Keio," or "Those guys are weird." But this year was a bit different.

In Kanagawa Prefecture and other prefectures as well, the number of teams with normal hair instead of buzz cuts has increased significantly in local tournaments. Furthermore, it's very pleasing that the number of teams with free hairstyles has increased considerably even at Koshien.

On a national level, probably more than half of the schools already have free hairstyles. However, when it comes to schools that make it to Koshien, this year it was 7 out of 49, so there are still only about 7 teams where it's okay to be free. This time, the semifinal was a matchup between us and Tsuchiura Nichidai, so it stood out, but in the end, you could also look at it the other way and say that you won't get strong enough to go to Koshien unless you have a buzz cut, so that area is still...

There is absolutely no rational reason when someone asks, "Why isn't our hairstyle free?" I think discussions are now arising in various places.

I think it's really good that you created an opportunity for discussion. It feels like the mountain has moved a little bit, doesn't it?

Mr. Moribayashi, you have been saying for a long time, including in your books, that you "want to change high school baseball." I'd like you to tell us a little more about this.

High school baseball has been a huge success centered around Koshien, and I think it has taken root as a form of culture rather than just a sport. Because it has been so exciting and its popularity has become so established, there are aspects that make it difficult to change. I think it's a world where many people still have old-fashioned ideas and fixed concepts, believing that things are fine as they are.

However, I think that in Keio baseball, including yourself, Mr. Ueda, and Mr. Yukichi Maeda, who served as the university baseball team manager, there has long been the thought of whether high school baseball is fine as it is and whether it can be changed for the better.

The phrase "Enjoy Baseball" was used by Mr. Maeda and Mr. Ueda, and that became one starting point for challenging the old parts of high school baseball and the parts that have been trapped in the past. Since that has now borne fruit in the form of a championship, I think we are currently in a position with strong influence.

It's not that we want every team in Japan to grow their hair out or play baseball like Keio, but rather that the allowed range for existing high school baseball was very narrow, so we want to broaden that range.

As I said in the final championship interview, I think society will become more diverse from now on, so I think high school baseball should also diversify and various types of teams should be recognized. I would be happy if our victory contributes to such a movement.

I used to hear about "Enjoy Baseball" from Mr. Yukichi Maeda all the time, and he was always saying, "Isn't high school baseball strange?" So I intended to practice what Mr. Maeda was doing, but Manager Moribayashi evolved that, and moreover, became number one in Japan and has communicated it tremendously.

Things that Keio University considered normal are surprisingly not accepted in the world. For example, it's no big deal for students to call you "Moribayashi-san," but there are many people who find it unbelievable to use "-san."

So, I always have the feeling that if you take what Keio University has been doing and the school spirit and apply it directly to baseball, it's bound to turn out like this. Mr. Moribayashi's championship interview was a very wonderful comment.

Since the purpose of the entire school is to be a leader of all society in the words of Yukichi Fukuzawa, as you said, rather than the baseball team doing something special, the entire Keio University is aiming for that.

Since the baseball team is within that, I have always thought that we naturally have a role and responsibility to be a leader or to open up new paths within high school baseball. I want to make this championship an opportunity to open that up.

But in this summer's Koshien, the sportsmanship, or the part about properly respecting the opponent, has clearly improved compared to five years ago, and it felt good. There was no sign stealing at all from the schools we played against, and there were smiles on both sides. There were really many teams playing baseball with good expressions and feeling good, so in that sense, I feel that things are changing.

Mr. Moribayashi, you have written a book called "Thinking Baseball." I came here today wanting to ask about the difference between Enjoy Baseball and Thinking Baseball (laughs).

I couldn't publish a book with the same title, so it was a recommendation from the publisher (laughs). I was able to play baseball as a member of your first class, Mr. Ueda, and that encounter was truly significant.

Influenced by you, I've worked with the feeling that this is the kind of baseball we should do and spread, so my feelings haven't changed. I'm sorry, but I've also kept the club precepts exactly as they were.

I want to draw out the part where you say, "I'm evolving this!" (laughs).

It's not exactly an evolution, but I want them to pursue the baseball they like for themselves. Regarding "Thinking," the most important thing is that I don't want them to do things just because they were taught that way since they were children or because they were told to do so by a coach in high school; I want them to think for themselves and go through trial and error.

Originally, because you want to get better, you should think, "Maybe I should throw like this," or "No, that's not it," and even if it's a detour, thinking for yourself should be important, and I want to place that at the foundation. When things don't go well, it's fruitless to blame the manager or coach, so I think there should first be something that you want to try doing yourself.

Mr. Moribayashi, I'm sure you provide technical guidance, but first you make them think and just wait. And then you tell them to go do it themselves. The biggest difference with someone like me is that I'm impatient. I'm the type to immediately say, "Let's do this, let's do that." Manager Horii at the university is even more so. About three times as impatient (laughs).

I think it's a matter of the players going through trial and error themselves, and you providing technical guidance for them to grow well. I suppose you could call it growth-supremacy. A manager who can wait for growth—I was watching thinking that this might be the keyword for the image of a high school baseball manager in the new era. It's hard to wait. High school baseball has a short amount of time. I felt that you are a manager who can wait for that.

What is your relationship with the players like?

Having normal conversations with the players is a basic premise, but I don't try to force conversation from my side too much. There are over 100 club members, and more than that, I try to observe the players well. For example, both I and the coaches on the staff side have made an effort so that they feel we are noticing changes and keeping a good eye on their form and physical condition.

Even if I say, "Come talk to me anytime on a flat level," high schoolers will definitely think, "No way can I talk to a 50-year-old." I leave the communication to the college coaches and staff.

That's good, because you have middle management.

I'm not trying to do everything by myself. I'm always doing it while feeling my own powerlessness. I ask everyone to help.

I have various experts come in, whether it's for mental health or treatment, and tell them to do as they like in our baseball club. Sometimes things get through to the players better when an expert in that field speaks properly than when I say it.

I'd like to hear what Mr. Moribayashi considers the "ideal form of Enjoy Baseball." What are you planning to do from now on? Now that you've taken the number one spot in Japan, does it feel like there's nothing left to do? (laughs)

No, no, not at all. Just because we won doesn't mean the next team gets a reward. We'll be fighting from scratch again in this autumn tournament, so I'm not soaking in the afterglow of the victory myself; my mind is already on the next team.

We became number one in Japan this time, but I want to continue doing my best each year and communicating our baseball as long as my energy and physical strength last.

This summer, in the game against Yokohama High School, if the position where the ball hit Sennosuke Watanabe's bat had been off by 1 millimeter, it would have been a fly ball to left, and it would have ended there. Sports is truly a world of paper-thin margins, and it's not at all a case of "it was good because we won this year" or "it was bad because we lost." We were allowed to win this year, but I want to view this as a championship built on 107 years of accumulated effort.

Every generation is working hard, so I don't want only this year's generation to be made into heroes. I want to make sure I don't misunderstand that myself, and I want people to see that what successive managers, directors, players, and coaches have done took a single form this year.

The ideal form would be if a team could be formed where I don't even need to be on the bench. Ultimately, it would be ideal to have a team where signs don't need to be given and it's okay even if the manager isn't on the bench. In reality, it's difficult, but it might be ideal to become a team where each individual thinks more independently and can proceed with games and practice as a team and organization without relying on the manager or coaches.

If the style of the high school spreads, that will broaden the range of high school baseball, and if that happens, there's a possibility that the number of children aiming for high school baseball and parents who want their children to do high school baseball will increase more than before.

That's very true. Please continue to create a team that other schools look up to.